amin
Aug 18, 10:28 PM
Obviously, inherently the iMac design is inferior to the Mac Pro/Powermac.
It may be obvious, but based on your earlier statement that a Conroe iMac would be "able to crunch through" apps faster than a Mac Pro, the obvious seemed worth identifying.
But I think there's a bigger reason why Apple chose to go all quad with the Mac Pro: Apple chose all quad because a duo option would have had the same performance in professional apps (again, excluding handbrake and toast which are the only two examples touted about). A single processor Woodcrest or Conroe option will have the same obtainable CPU power for 90-95% of the professional market for another 6-12 months at the very least.
So you think they put an extra processor in across the line just to be able to say they had a quad? Even the AnandTech article you used as a source showed here (http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2816&p=18) that PS took advantage of quad cores in Rosetta
Here's some data regarding the Mac Pro's FSB:
*snip*
What can we take from this? Because of the use of FB-DIMMs, the Mac Pro's effective FSB is that of ~640MHz DDR2 system.
And how does it fare in memory latency?
*snip*
Your points about latency and FSB are not separate negatives as you have made them. They are redundant theoretical concerns with implications of unclear practical significance.
As for bandwidth, although the Mac Pro has a load of theoretical bandwidth, the efficiency is an abysmal 20%. In real use a DDR2 system has 72% more usable bandwidth. (source here (http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2816&p=11))
I don't know bout you, but if I were a heavy user of memory intensive apps such as Photoshop, I'd be worried. Worried in the sense that a Conroe would be noticeably faster.
I am not worried. Everything anyone has come up with on this issue are taken from that same AnandTech article. Until I see more real-world testing, I will not be convinced. Also, I expect that more pro apps such as PS will be able to utilize quad cores in the near future, if they aren't already doing so. Finally, even if Conroe is faster, Woodcrest is fast enough for me ;).
Memory issues aside, Woodcrests are faster than Conroes, 2.4% on average (source here (http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.aspx?i=2795&p=6))
I think you misread that. They were comparing Core 2 Extreme (not Woodcrest) and Conroe to see whether the increased FSB of the former would make much difference.
It may be obvious, but based on your earlier statement that a Conroe iMac would be "able to crunch through" apps faster than a Mac Pro, the obvious seemed worth identifying.
But I think there's a bigger reason why Apple chose to go all quad with the Mac Pro: Apple chose all quad because a duo option would have had the same performance in professional apps (again, excluding handbrake and toast which are the only two examples touted about). A single processor Woodcrest or Conroe option will have the same obtainable CPU power for 90-95% of the professional market for another 6-12 months at the very least.
So you think they put an extra processor in across the line just to be able to say they had a quad? Even the AnandTech article you used as a source showed here (http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2816&p=18) that PS took advantage of quad cores in Rosetta
Here's some data regarding the Mac Pro's FSB:
*snip*
What can we take from this? Because of the use of FB-DIMMs, the Mac Pro's effective FSB is that of ~640MHz DDR2 system.
And how does it fare in memory latency?
*snip*
Your points about latency and FSB are not separate negatives as you have made them. They are redundant theoretical concerns with implications of unclear practical significance.
As for bandwidth, although the Mac Pro has a load of theoretical bandwidth, the efficiency is an abysmal 20%. In real use a DDR2 system has 72% more usable bandwidth. (source here (http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2816&p=11))
I don't know bout you, but if I were a heavy user of memory intensive apps such as Photoshop, I'd be worried. Worried in the sense that a Conroe would be noticeably faster.
I am not worried. Everything anyone has come up with on this issue are taken from that same AnandTech article. Until I see more real-world testing, I will not be convinced. Also, I expect that more pro apps such as PS will be able to utilize quad cores in the near future, if they aren't already doing so. Finally, even if Conroe is faster, Woodcrest is fast enough for me ;).
Memory issues aside, Woodcrests are faster than Conroes, 2.4% on average (source here (http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.aspx?i=2795&p=6))
I think you misread that. They were comparing Core 2 Extreme (not Woodcrest) and Conroe to see whether the increased FSB of the former would make much difference.
rezenclowd3
Aug 5, 01:06 PM
I think I will only enjoy the game should I buy a very expensive racing wheel. I already have the seat setup.... a racing game using the standard controller is just odd.
Pre-ordered the US Collectors edition, but now I would like to change that for the UK edition... I am ready to drop my pre-order should the multiplayer review prove lacking, and hopefully they give darn good penalties for hack driving online (DQ, through pit lane etc) Rubbing IS NOT racing! That's for drivers who do not have control of their car.
Pre-ordered the US Collectors edition, but now I would like to change that for the UK edition... I am ready to drop my pre-order should the multiplayer review prove lacking, and hopefully they give darn good penalties for hack driving online (DQ, through pit lane etc) Rubbing IS NOT racing! That's for drivers who do not have control of their car.
marmotmammal
Apr 6, 02:41 PM
As with many FCP users, I am very accustomed to the entire FCP workflow. The editing is awesome and fuss-free. Of course, there are always complaints. Compressor constantly gets low grades. Transcoding is painful to some. Nevertheless, FCP can activate multiple events so the computer can process these things unattended as I frolic in the park or do other things.
I've tried Premiere Pro and Sony Vegas. I have Premiere Elements 9 on hand if I need native AVCHD editing. But FCP has the guts I prefer. It's akin to my excursion from Pro Tools to Logic Pro. Ultimately I returned to Pro Tools for the editing features, irrespectively of the realtime bounce.
'hoping that the FCP upgrade next week is stellar. It will be painful to switch to another NLE.
I've tried Premiere Pro and Sony Vegas. I have Premiere Elements 9 on hand if I need native AVCHD editing. But FCP has the guts I prefer. It's akin to my excursion from Pro Tools to Logic Pro. Ultimately I returned to Pro Tools for the editing features, irrespectively of the realtime bounce.
'hoping that the FCP upgrade next week is stellar. It will be painful to switch to another NLE.
hyperpasta
Nov 28, 06:27 PM
And I don't understand why they should...Can somebody explain it?
The rationale is that iPods are used only for stolen music (which they aren't) and this will help offset the losses (which it won't).
The rationale is that iPods are used only for stolen music (which they aren't) and this will help offset the losses (which it won't).
mcoyne
Apr 27, 08:40 AM
Poo. I'd rather have the option to keep backing up that cache file to iTunes. I like the ability to see a map of where I've been using the iPhoneTracker app. :(
Agreed! Stupid whiners. I hope they will add an option to let your iphone continue keeping a cache of all your locations.
Agreed! Stupid whiners. I hope they will add an option to let your iphone continue keeping a cache of all your locations.
SiliconAddict
Aug 6, 03:27 AM
This kind of thinking is truly lame, just buy a Dell and go for penis enlargement surgury with the money you saved. No one will know the difference.
Not lame. Childish. I mean seriously. Is your (Generic your.) MBP any slower the day after they announce Core 2 MBPs? I swear to god it's almost as if people's lives are so incomplete that they need to feel special by having the top of the dog pile hardware. I received my MBP on Feb 21st at 10:30AM. Apple can do whatever they want. I'll still be enjoying my Mac at the same level I did on the 21st.
Not lame. Childish. I mean seriously. Is your (Generic your.) MBP any slower the day after they announce Core 2 MBPs? I swear to god it's almost as if people's lives are so incomplete that they need to feel special by having the top of the dog pile hardware. I received my MBP on Feb 21st at 10:30AM. Apple can do whatever they want. I'll still be enjoying my Mac at the same level I did on the 21st.
bedifferent
Apr 27, 11:13 AM
Maybe you'd prefer discourse where everyone agreed and had the same opinion as you. Maybe some white fluffy bunnies too? ;) I kid.
At the end of the day - an issue was indentified. Apple is responding. Arguing whether or not there is an issue is silly. Arguing whether or not Apple is responding is silly.
That's not addressed to you - but everyone at this point
Civil discourse is great, arguing over silly semantics on an issue when all the facts have not been fully presented seems to be "putting the cart before the horse."
As they say, opinions are like a**holes, everyone has em and they all stink ;)
At the end of the day - an issue was indentified. Apple is responding. Arguing whether or not there is an issue is silly. Arguing whether or not Apple is responding is silly.
That's not addressed to you - but everyone at this point
Civil discourse is great, arguing over silly semantics on an issue when all the facts have not been fully presented seems to be "putting the cart before the horse."
As they say, opinions are like a**holes, everyone has em and they all stink ;)
bushido
Mar 22, 08:24 PM
love that UI, iOS looks like windows 95 compared to the latest offers on the market, some things need to change. getting kinda tired of it after 3 iPhones
ZoomZoomZoom
Sep 18, 11:10 PM
Surprise?
News Flash: Apple to update chips in incredibly expensive pro laptop line no more than 3 months after competitors!
They better be updated by the 26th. Not only is any later date even more ridiculously late, but I'm starting to get kernal panics on my old computer. -_-
News Flash: Apple to update chips in incredibly expensive pro laptop line no more than 3 months after competitors!
They better be updated by the 26th. Not only is any later date even more ridiculously late, but I'm starting to get kernal panics on my old computer. -_-
aafuss1
Aug 6, 05:38 PM
That's funny. A nice little jab at M$. Classic!
A nice jab at MS-at least with Leopard, there's only 1 edition unlike M$'s 7 for Vista.
A nice jab at MS-at least with Leopard, there's only 1 edition unlike M$'s 7 for Vista.
NoSmokingBandit
Aug 17, 09:30 PM
What you scale the difficulty up? On NFS:Shift, I started on easy A.I, quickly moved to normal, and am now doing most of my races on hard A.I. My car settings for traction and control and such is normal.
I havent played it in a while, but i recall setting traction control to standard, AI to the hardest, and everything else to the hard/realistic settings. I was racing with my DFGT wheel and it all just felt really easy. I was safely taking turns faster than i would ever attempt in GT4.
I havent played it in a while, but i recall setting traction control to standard, AI to the hardest, and everything else to the hard/realistic settings. I was racing with my DFGT wheel and it all just felt really easy. I was safely taking turns faster than i would ever attempt in GT4.
AppleScruff1
Apr 9, 10:01 PM
I'd wait for Haswell or maybe even Rockwell which will be the 16nm shrink of Haswell.
neko girl
Mar 7, 07:56 PM
I won't rejoin this discussion. But since neko girl may be waiting for my reply, I'll only suggest a source (http://www.tfp.org/images/books/Defending_A_Higher_Law.pdf).
We may disagree on philosophical or moral levels, but I'm not here to involve you in anything you find to be unpleasant. We're on an internet forum, a tech gadget forum of all things, and we're all here to have a good time. If the discussion agitates you (and it's legitimate to feel that way, you are human), then I would not want you to respond.
I'd rather that whatever you're participating in makes you a happy person.
I haven't read the pdf. I will do so now..
We may disagree on philosophical or moral levels, but I'm not here to involve you in anything you find to be unpleasant. We're on an internet forum, a tech gadget forum of all things, and we're all here to have a good time. If the discussion agitates you (and it's legitimate to feel that way, you are human), then I would not want you to respond.
I'd rather that whatever you're participating in makes you a happy person.
I haven't read the pdf. I will do so now..
gugy
Aug 17, 12:17 PM
"Sixteen Core Tigerton Setup about $6,000" :eek:
I want one!
I want one!
osofast240sx
Apr 8, 07:56 AM
I work at Best Buy, and I can tell you this "rumor" is not true.
First, we do not have daily quotas on iPad sales, although we do have overall budget goals as any company would. iPads had no impact on this.
iPad 2's have been extremely hard to keep in stock, and at least for my store and all the stores in my region, they would sell out within hours of receiving a pretty good sized shipment. (Although the Verizon ones dont sell as well as others, they still sell out too) We did not hold anything back... do you think we like the hundreds of calls and dozens of people asking us if we have any in stock? We took care of every customer we could. In checking inventory levels at other stores, it was zero's all the way down the list.
We are experiencing inventory issues with the iPad. Be it simple unexpected demand, the earthquake in Japan, or Apple wanting to take care of customers through their website and retail store before big box stores... I dont know. But stores certainly are not sitting on them.what you(Best Buy) did was take $100 from the customer and lock them in from buying anywere else!
First, we do not have daily quotas on iPad sales, although we do have overall budget goals as any company would. iPads had no impact on this.
iPad 2's have been extremely hard to keep in stock, and at least for my store and all the stores in my region, they would sell out within hours of receiving a pretty good sized shipment. (Although the Verizon ones dont sell as well as others, they still sell out too) We did not hold anything back... do you think we like the hundreds of calls and dozens of people asking us if we have any in stock? We took care of every customer we could. In checking inventory levels at other stores, it was zero's all the way down the list.
We are experiencing inventory issues with the iPad. Be it simple unexpected demand, the earthquake in Japan, or Apple wanting to take care of customers through their website and retail store before big box stores... I dont know. But stores certainly are not sitting on them.what you(Best Buy) did was take $100 from the customer and lock them in from buying anywere else!
alpacojohn
Aug 25, 05:42 PM
Funny how I just came across this thread, as I'm in the middle of an Apple support nightmare as well (I have one of those MacBooks that just turns itself off for no reason - completely unacceptable). I have been routed through 12 people over 3 calls, with several promises of "expedited resolution"s but no tangible result.
Although it's possible (and likely) that the prevalence of the MacBook defects have been overblown, I do know that Apple's support process puts you through a lot of hoops to get any major issue resolved (e.g., replacing a clearly defective product). Each person I've talked to has been courteous, but in the end I still have no faith in their ability to actually solve my problem in a timely manner.
Frustrated Apple User
Although it's possible (and likely) that the prevalence of the MacBook defects have been overblown, I do know that Apple's support process puts you through a lot of hoops to get any major issue resolved (e.g., replacing a clearly defective product). Each person I've talked to has been courteous, but in the end I still have no faith in their ability to actually solve my problem in a timely manner.
Frustrated Apple User
snebes
Apr 11, 12:29 PM
My 3Gs contract ends in June and Apple will be pushing it's luck for me to go half a year without me being tempted to jump platforms instead of waiting for the iPhone 5.
You do know that Apple's FISCAL Year 2012 starts around the end of September, meaning you would wait around 3-4 months assuming this rumor is true?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiscal_year
I don't mean to single you out, but I see this confusion every time a fiscal year is mentioned, and it bugs me. I don't care if you switch to a different phone. Hell, just get the iPhone 4, it is a world of difference compared to the the iPhone 3G (I just made the switch from 3G to 4 a few months ago, I couldn't stand how slow the 3G was)
You do know that Apple's FISCAL Year 2012 starts around the end of September, meaning you would wait around 3-4 months assuming this rumor is true?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiscal_year
I don't mean to single you out, but I see this confusion every time a fiscal year is mentioned, and it bugs me. I don't care if you switch to a different phone. Hell, just get the iPhone 4, it is a world of difference compared to the the iPhone 3G (I just made the switch from 3G to 4 a few months ago, I couldn't stand how slow the 3G was)
playaj82
Aug 7, 03:37 PM
If the rumor sites were right....
Mac Pro
Leopard
iPhone
Core 2 Duo
iMac
Tablet, etc...
the keynote would have been 6 hours.
I'm glad they took their time with Leopard and highlighted some neat new and much needed additions to tiger.
Mac Pro
Leopard
iPhone
Core 2 Duo
iMac
Tablet, etc...
the keynote would have been 6 hours.
I'm glad they took their time with Leopard and highlighted some neat new and much needed additions to tiger.
Dr.Gargoyle
Aug 7, 01:37 PM
Looks like a good time to let my PM D1.25Ghz G4 retire... The new MP must be at least 10 times faster. :eek:
Apple store up again. The old PM G5 seem to be gone.
Apple store up again. The old PM G5 seem to be gone.
dornoforpyros
Jul 14, 02:57 PM
eh I'm willing to bet they stick with the g5 type case, I mean the macbook is the only "new" case we've seen with the intel transition.
kavika411
Mar 24, 12:49 PM
Fixed that for you.
Where does race come into this? I don't ask rhetorically. I may have missed it.
Where does race come into this? I don't ask rhetorically. I may have missed it.
yoak
Apr 12, 09:25 AM
I don't use batch monitor so I'm not sure where to look. It doesn't show much more than compressor, merely the name of the job and a progress bar. I see that the little inspector window should show the "segments" (I'm not sure they call it that in Englsh), but I don't see any segments in the test encoding I just did. Plus, disabling task segmentation (fragmentation?) in the encoder settings doesn't change the CPU load. Maybe a source file isn't split when QMaster isn't configured
Anyway, the encoding uses 4 cores since CPU usages exceeds 300%. I'm positive it uses all of my cores. As a comparison, by Mac Pro is more than twice faster than my friend's iMac, which has 2 core but roughly similar CPU speed (GHz).
You open it from Compressor, in the top right corner. Then, if you have a cluster (set up in Qmaster) it will show on top of "Your computer"
Here you can monitor your render progress and see how many cores are used.
See attached screen shot
Anyway, the encoding uses 4 cores since CPU usages exceeds 300%. I'm positive it uses all of my cores. As a comparison, by Mac Pro is more than twice faster than my friend's iMac, which has 2 core but roughly similar CPU speed (GHz).
You open it from Compressor, in the top right corner. Then, if you have a cluster (set up in Qmaster) it will show on top of "Your computer"
Here you can monitor your render progress and see how many cores are used.
See attached screen shot
winterspan
Apr 11, 05:27 PM
80%* of potential purchasers won't have access to LTE for at least another year from then. ...
[*made up statistic, but I bet it's not far wrong! :D ]
Verizon's 4G/LTE service will be live in ~140 metro areas by Q42011
[*made up statistic, but I bet it's not far wrong! :D ]
Verizon's 4G/LTE service will be live in ~140 metro areas by Q42011
Nuvi
Apr 5, 10:36 PM
Nobody's using Blu-Ray, in my experience. It's just another way of sucking money out of home consumers. Everything's done online in terms of delivery...'
Wake up and smell the coffee... BR is the main distribution method for paid HD content in the world. Also the quality is far better then with any download service.
Wake up and smell the coffee... BR is the main distribution method for paid HD content in the world. Also the quality is far better then with any download service.
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