tortoise
Aug 23, 03:04 PM
Do you have a reference showing that this translates to better performance in real-world application tests in a head to head competition?
Not handy, since a lot of this happened on mailing lists.
The short version is that the memory performance scales in a very sub-linear fashion as a function of the number of cores being used, whereas Opteron scalability is almost linear up to a large number of cores. The good news is that for single dual-core processors the memory performance is on par with dual-core Opterons and their in-cache performance can be better. The bad news is that this performance does not hold as you scale cores in a system. So for some applications (e.g. those that live mostly in cache) the Woodcrest processors will be mildly faster than Opterons, but for most the performance is about even in real app benchmarks.
I've seen fairly comprehensive benchmarks for both databases and scientific computing applications, both of which thoroughly exercise the memory subsystem. Even though a single Intel core theoretically has more bandwidth, the high latency means that the real bandwidth is about the same as the slower Opterons (which have real bandwidth that approaches theoretical) and the cross-sectional bandwidth of Opterons when you get up to 4 cores and higher is much higher since the scaling is almost linear with the number of cores. For Intel, I think it was the case that a bigger cache was a cheaper design choice than a truly scalable memory subsystem. As a result, they will have different competencies. Some types of floating point codes should run very well on Intel.
Not handy, since a lot of this happened on mailing lists.
The short version is that the memory performance scales in a very sub-linear fashion as a function of the number of cores being used, whereas Opteron scalability is almost linear up to a large number of cores. The good news is that for single dual-core processors the memory performance is on par with dual-core Opterons and their in-cache performance can be better. The bad news is that this performance does not hold as you scale cores in a system. So for some applications (e.g. those that live mostly in cache) the Woodcrest processors will be mildly faster than Opterons, but for most the performance is about even in real app benchmarks.
I've seen fairly comprehensive benchmarks for both databases and scientific computing applications, both of which thoroughly exercise the memory subsystem. Even though a single Intel core theoretically has more bandwidth, the high latency means that the real bandwidth is about the same as the slower Opterons (which have real bandwidth that approaches theoretical) and the cross-sectional bandwidth of Opterons when you get up to 4 cores and higher is much higher since the scaling is almost linear with the number of cores. For Intel, I think it was the case that a bigger cache was a cheaper design choice than a truly scalable memory subsystem. As a result, they will have different competencies. Some types of floating point codes should run very well on Intel.
starflyer
Nov 29, 11:03 AM
Oh yeah - for anyone who thinks most music these days sucks, you're just looking in the wrong place. Major labels ceased to produce anything of worth quite some time ago. Dig a little deeper and there's a wealth of wonderful music being made right now (and over the last 10 years specifically).
I'll help you dig...
www.sf59.com
www.toothandnailrecords.com
www.themilitiagroup.com
www.velvetbluemusic.com
www.jadetree.com
I'll help you dig...
www.sf59.com
www.toothandnailrecords.com
www.themilitiagroup.com
www.velvetbluemusic.com
www.jadetree.com
handsome pete
Apr 5, 08:31 PM
download/streaming version that will be usable for buying up to 4K movies through iTunes.
Everything else you said is all well and good, but why on earth would anyone need to download a 4K movie?
Everything else you said is all well and good, but why on earth would anyone need to download a 4K movie?
Tears Apart
Mar 25, 10:30 PM
*roar*
bring it on, i'm ready
bring it on, i'm ready
wmmk
Jul 14, 03:30 PM
You would think they would come out with the fastest chip...
I mean what seperates them from a Dell or HP workstation that is top of the line? OS X (yes), but to the ones on the fence that doesn't justify paying more for less.
A 2.66 Ghz Woodcrest will probably be faster than a 2.93Ghz Conroe. A 1.83Ghz Yonah is faster than a 3.2Ghz Pentium, right?;)
I mean what seperates them from a Dell or HP workstation that is top of the line? OS X (yes), but to the ones on the fence that doesn't justify paying more for less.
A 2.66 Ghz Woodcrest will probably be faster than a 2.93Ghz Conroe. A 1.83Ghz Yonah is faster than a 3.2Ghz Pentium, right?;)
Erasmus
Jul 21, 11:55 PM
So I read in this thread that Kentsfield and Clovertown ARE compatible with Conroe and Woodcrest sockets (respectively) (Cloverton or Clovertown?)
Hope for upgrading an iMac to Quad Core is kindled! At least if Apple releases Conroe iMacs.
BTW, In my opinion, one thing a person should never, ever say is some computer has too much power, and that it will never be needed. So when 128 core CPUs come out in ~10 years time, will we still be considering dual core CPUs as fast enough for our use?
I seem to remember that when the original DOS operating system was created, its RAM was limited. I can't remember exactly to how much, but it was decided that people would never use more than a few kilobytes of memory. Now we are arguing that Mac should provide no less than a gigabyte! Now we are moving to 64 bit processing, with its capability to address a few exobytes, or millions of Terabytes of storage, it seems impossible that we will ever need 128bit computing. But, no doubt, one day we will.
When we will be able to download our entire lives, and even conciousness into a computer, as is said to happen in about 40 years (very much looking forward to), I dare say it will take a lot of memory to do, and even more processing power to manage effectively, especially if we wanted to "live" inside computers, as we will no doubt want to do someday.
So as a conclusion to my most recent rant, Please, never tell me a computer is too powerfu, has too many cores, or has too much storage capacity. If it is there to be used, it will be used. It always is.
Hope for upgrading an iMac to Quad Core is kindled! At least if Apple releases Conroe iMacs.
BTW, In my opinion, one thing a person should never, ever say is some computer has too much power, and that it will never be needed. So when 128 core CPUs come out in ~10 years time, will we still be considering dual core CPUs as fast enough for our use?
I seem to remember that when the original DOS operating system was created, its RAM was limited. I can't remember exactly to how much, but it was decided that people would never use more than a few kilobytes of memory. Now we are arguing that Mac should provide no less than a gigabyte! Now we are moving to 64 bit processing, with its capability to address a few exobytes, or millions of Terabytes of storage, it seems impossible that we will ever need 128bit computing. But, no doubt, one day we will.
When we will be able to download our entire lives, and even conciousness into a computer, as is said to happen in about 40 years (very much looking forward to), I dare say it will take a lot of memory to do, and even more processing power to manage effectively, especially if we wanted to "live" inside computers, as we will no doubt want to do someday.
So as a conclusion to my most recent rant, Please, never tell me a computer is too powerfu, has too many cores, or has too much storage capacity. If it is there to be used, it will be used. It always is.
Abstract
Sep 18, 11:40 PM
Of course they're going to refresh the laptops before the holidays. Duh. :rolleyes:
Agreed.
I can't believe this would even count as a rumour. It's more an "inevitability."
Agreed.
I can't believe this would even count as a rumour. It's more an "inevitability."
Lesser Evets
Mar 26, 08:21 AM
Please release OS X Lion on a cool Apple flash drive :cool:
Seriously. When will this optical media finally begin to die?
You can buy a 4GB flash drive for under $4 these days. I'm sure Apple can work that into the price of the OS for another $2 or so. When flash drives of 4GB are under $1, I expect an exodus from these mechanical pieces of junk.
Lion will be just a mere touch of make-up and a few changes towards making the experience of the newest and most profitable business of Apple... AppStore.
I haven't seen anything in the preview of Lion that comes close to being a necessary addition or even a "wow". So I agree with you: it's a way to sell Apps better. Their OS'x have been disappointing for years. I will probably end any new OS purchases with Snow Leopard, until I get a new computer in 4 years.
Seriously. When will this optical media finally begin to die?
You can buy a 4GB flash drive for under $4 these days. I'm sure Apple can work that into the price of the OS for another $2 or so. When flash drives of 4GB are under $1, I expect an exodus from these mechanical pieces of junk.
Lion will be just a mere touch of make-up and a few changes towards making the experience of the newest and most profitable business of Apple... AppStore.
I haven't seen anything in the preview of Lion that comes close to being a necessary addition or even a "wow". So I agree with you: it's a way to sell Apps better. Their OS'x have been disappointing for years. I will probably end any new OS purchases with Snow Leopard, until I get a new computer in 4 years.
j_maddison
Jul 20, 11:53 AM
How fast do you want mail to go?
As fast as possible! Don't worry I do agree that e mail and browsing has very little to do with the processor speed, still you did ask the question! Now if only I could get a fibre link to my house without it costing a few hundred thousand Pounds a year hmm :rolleyes:
As fast as possible! Don't worry I do agree that e mail and browsing has very little to do with the processor speed, still you did ask the question! Now if only I could get a fibre link to my house without it costing a few hundred thousand Pounds a year hmm :rolleyes:
eseminario
Jun 9, 01:42 AM
Anybody knows if thebunlocked version will be available on launch day too?
CaoCao
Mar 4, 04:01 PM
The problem with your "logic" is that not everybody is gay. Homosexuality is nothing new, gay people have been around for a long time, and humanity is surviving.
Except I was responding to a post that suggested heterosexuals stop having sex...
Except I was responding to a post that suggested heterosexuals stop having sex...
netdog
Aug 11, 10:52 AM
I wonder if it's going to be a toy or a real phone. I'm hoping it's more of a smartphone than a ngage phone. (i know they couldn't make a phone that bad if they tried, just tryint to get a point out there.)
It seems to me that there may be two phones coming here. I wouldn't be surprised if one has a full keyboard, either on touchscreen or using conventional buttons, and one is simpler.
It seems to me that there may be two phones coming here. I wouldn't be surprised if one has a full keyboard, either on touchscreen or using conventional buttons, and one is simpler.
mikeapple
Apr 7, 10:58 PM
Best Buy as ALWAYS been really ****** to the customer...
Always had run-ins with workers there and the management always takes the side of the rude sales person... SCREW YOU BEST BUY.. I hope Apple pulls out
Always had run-ins with workers there and the management always takes the side of the rude sales person... SCREW YOU BEST BUY.. I hope Apple pulls out
merk850
Jul 28, 07:41 PM
Well we all know how Apple works with when things are due.
Look at the G5 laptop.
Tweak or no tweak, the return will cost money and getting a refurbished is not getting a new one.
CounterPoint: If he is just going to take it back to buy a refurbished one, why take it back.
He allready has it! Thats a roundabout way to work, isnt it?
If you take it back, you wait for the new one, why spend the money for restocking and not get the new one?
The question remains, what are you going to get with a new iMac that you dont have now?
If you were going to get a MacPro, then I would say, my god, return that iMac and get a new MacPro, if not then keep what you got and use it for the next 2 months and enjoy it,, cheers!
Multimedia, Snowy and Grokgod,
Thanks for the continued thoughts. A store manager said she would be flexible with the 14 day return date, as lnog as I understand that I would pay the restock fee of 10%. What that means to me is I will hold on to this machine until the WWDC and if new model is announced I will return and repurchase, eating the restock fee.( Kind of a pay for usage plan I look at it as.) If no new enhancements are announced with the iMac i guess I will keep mine.
However, there is the thought as one of you have brought up to just reetuen and wait until Sept. when it may be more likely to arrive. A slippery slop0e I know but I am leaning mroe toward a return and repurchase, as a sort of insruance policy of sorts.
I know I can't have my cake and eat it...., but I was looking for insight into how likely an improvement in the iMac is this August.
Thanks again!
Merk850
Look at the G5 laptop.
Tweak or no tweak, the return will cost money and getting a refurbished is not getting a new one.
CounterPoint: If he is just going to take it back to buy a refurbished one, why take it back.
He allready has it! Thats a roundabout way to work, isnt it?
If you take it back, you wait for the new one, why spend the money for restocking and not get the new one?
The question remains, what are you going to get with a new iMac that you dont have now?
If you were going to get a MacPro, then I would say, my god, return that iMac and get a new MacPro, if not then keep what you got and use it for the next 2 months and enjoy it,, cheers!
Multimedia, Snowy and Grokgod,
Thanks for the continued thoughts. A store manager said she would be flexible with the 14 day return date, as lnog as I understand that I would pay the restock fee of 10%. What that means to me is I will hold on to this machine until the WWDC and if new model is announced I will return and repurchase, eating the restock fee.( Kind of a pay for usage plan I look at it as.) If no new enhancements are announced with the iMac i guess I will keep mine.
However, there is the thought as one of you have brought up to just reetuen and wait until Sept. when it may be more likely to arrive. A slippery slop0e I know but I am leaning mroe toward a return and repurchase, as a sort of insruance policy of sorts.
I know I can't have my cake and eat it...., but I was looking for insight into how likely an improvement in the iMac is this August.
Thanks again!
Merk850
CrackedButter
Aug 26, 03:07 PM
One more update for .mac in Sept. If they don't give me a compelling reason to continue, next year I will not re-subscribe. There I made my mind. LOL
For some reason I watched this year's MacWorld Keynote again tonight and I didn't realise the amount of new features there are in the new iLife 06. A lot of them deal with .mac. I'm quite happy with those features if and when I get iLife 06 or even a new mac at some point.
I would say they are improving the service but it doesn't happen overnight.
For some reason I watched this year's MacWorld Keynote again tonight and I didn't realise the amount of new features there are in the new iLife 06. A lot of them deal with .mac. I'm quite happy with those features if and when I get iLife 06 or even a new mac at some point.
I would say they are improving the service but it doesn't happen overnight.
bobthedino
Apr 27, 08:48 AM
Why did it take so long for Apple to release a statement?
How long would have been reasonable, do you think? A week is not too bad, especially considering we've just had the Easter holidays.
Also it's surely better to spend time to get something right. Clearly Apple has had to investigate the iOS source code to find out what was actually going on, as it obviously wasn't behaving as expected. Finding the right engineers and actually doing the work isn't a matter of hours.
How long would have been reasonable, do you think? A week is not too bad, especially considering we've just had the Easter holidays.
Also it's surely better to spend time to get something right. Clearly Apple has had to investigate the iOS source code to find out what was actually going on, as it obviously wasn't behaving as expected. Finding the right engineers and actually doing the work isn't a matter of hours.
Scruff
Aug 11, 11:28 AM
This is probably the rumored Apple product I look forward to the most. Could really use a new phone, :p.
Ivabign
Apr 6, 03:58 PM
Nice...I'm glad to have a more rare piece of hardware. I love mine and have no issues, it'll only get better over time.Reminds me of the days of the RAZR, that's what the iPhone and iPad have become.
Honda sells a TON more cars than BMW by a huge factor...I'd rather drive a BMW, I guess you're all happy with the Hondas :)
I think if you were told you could only use unpaved roads in your BMW - you'd beat a path to your Honda dealer.
Honda sells a TON more cars than BMW by a huge factor...I'd rather drive a BMW, I guess you're all happy with the Hondas :)
I think if you were told you could only use unpaved roads in your BMW - you'd beat a path to your Honda dealer.
Daremo
Apr 19, 01:28 PM
The sales numbers are impressive, but not surprising.
ingenious
Aug 11, 10:16 AM
I really hope Apple comes out with a phone that's an awesome phone, music player, and smart phone... Is that asking too much?
Oh, and it needs to cost US$200 or less (preferably less). :D :rolleyes:
edit: after reading article, it looks pretty promising! :)
Oh, and it needs to cost US$200 or less (preferably less). :D :rolleyes:
edit: after reading article, it looks pretty promising! :)
Hellhammer
Dec 7, 08:49 AM
Anyone know where to get a fast car? My level isn't enough for the good ones in store (only 21 atm, need 23) but all my opponents have +900hp ~700kg cars so my 840hp Lambo just doesn't cut it anymore. Have around 1.8m cash plus 40 cars so money isn't an issue but I just can't find any :(
sososowhat
Aug 7, 03:17 PM
The new HW is fine, but Leopard is exciting! I'll look forward to this as I have all the big cats. Time machine is a great idea; love the additions to iChat & spotlight.
HecubusPro
Sep 19, 09:20 AM
It's not going to happen today. No worries. We have Photokina ahead of us.
angrynstupid
Apr 27, 08:02 AM
I actually thought looking at a history of where my phone has been on a map was kinda cool. Bummer.
Since I'm neither a criminal nor paranoid, I thought it was kind of cool/interesting too.
Since I'm neither a criminal nor paranoid, I thought it was kind of cool/interesting too.
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